Human Depravity: A Lost Christian Doctrine

“If the case be such indeed, that all mankind are by nature in a state of total ruin,…then, doubtless, the great salvation by Christ stands in direct relation to this ruin, as the remedy to the disease.”

—Jonathan Edwards—

Introduction

Author and conservative talk show host Dennis Prager stated, “No issue has a greater influence on determining your social and political views than whether you view human nature as basically good or not.”[1]

I think Prager is correct. But even more important and foundational than your social and political views, your view of human nature has important ramifications with regard to your theology. Perhaps second only to what you believe about God, no issue has greater influence on determining your theological views than whether you view human nature as basically good or not. It is no coincidence that theological liberals who deny doctrines such as original sin and human depravity also, more often than not, end up rejecting other scriptural teachings such as justification by grace through faith, the necessity and exclusivity of Jesus Christ for salvation, penal substitutionary atonement, the biblical doctrine of hell, or just simply scratch their head and wonder inquisitively when reading scriptural passages concerning God’s judgment on sin (e.g., the flood, destruction of the Canaanites, etc.). They ask themselves, “Why is God mad all the time?? I don’t get it!!”

Much of modern secular sensibility seems attracted to the idea that human beings at their core are basically good. In his book What Americans Believe, George Barna of Barna Research Group found that 87% of non-Christians agreed with the statement “People are basically good.” But this belief in the inherent goodness of humankind isn’t peculiar to non-Christians. It has found its way into the Church as well. In that same study, Barna also found that 77% of self-described born-again Christians agreed with the statement. Perhaps most shocking, of those self-described born-again Christians who identify themselves as mainline Protestant, 90% agreed with the statement “People are basically good.”[2]

Jesus on the Problem of Evil

In Luke 13:1-5 we have Jesus’ clearest teaching on the problem of evil:[1]

"Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish."

Not only is this Jesus’ clearest teaching on the problem of evil but we see Him addressing both moral and natural evil in His response. Notice that Jesus is first questioned regarding an example of what we would call moral evil: the murder of some Galileans by Pilate. In providing an answer, Jesus Himself introduces an example of natural evil: the falling of the tower of Siloam which killed eighteen.

Upcoming Apologetics Series

First Baptist Church of Lakewood will be hosting an outstanding six-week apologetics series entitled Uncovering the Christian Faith.

The series will take place Wednesday nights from 6:30 to 8:00 pm, beginning the first week of September. The event is free! Childcare and kid's youth programs are also provided. Invite your friends and family members!

Lectures include:

September 5 - Arguments for the Existence of God, by Dr. J.P. Moreland

September 12 - The Historical Reliability of the New Testament, by Dr. Fred Sanders

September 19 - Introduction to Apologetics and the Resurrection of Jesus, by Dr. Craig Hazen

September 26 - The Case for Intelligent Design, by Dr. John Bloom

October 3 - Why God Allows Evil, by Dr. Clay Jones

October 10 - Christianity and the Challenge of World Religions, by Dr. Craig Hazen

Location: First Baptist Church of Lakewood
5336 Arbor Road
Long Beach, CA
Phone: (562) 420-1471

Visit First Baptist Church of Lakewood or Biola Apologetics Events for any additional information. Audio recordings of the lectures will also be made available.

Why the Problem of Evil is a Problem

The so-called problem of evil is one of the most common objections raised against the Christian faith. Perhaps no one has more succinctly stated the apparent contradiction between an all-loving, all-powerful God and the existence of evil as the eighteenth-century Scottish skeptic David Hume:

"Is he willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is impotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Whence then is evil?"[1]

More modern skeptics have sometimes posed the logical problem this way:

1.      If God is all-good (omnibenevolent), He would prevent evil.

2.      If God is all-powerful (omnipotent), He could prevent evil.

3.      If God is all-knowing (omniscient), He knows how to prevent evil.

4.      But evil exists.

5.      Therefore, either God is not all-good, all-powerful, or all-knowing (or maybe He doesn’t exist!)

But why is the problem of evil a problem? In answering this question it is important to earnestly think through the following points, points which often are not reflected upon or not contemplated deeply enough. These considerations must be taken into account when addressing the problem of evil, especially from within the Christian worldview. When they are, I believe the problem of evil (POE) largely resolves itself.

Rob Bell Agrees with Atheists on Hell

If you think Jesus threatens you with eternal torment unless you believe in him, you’re out of step with traditional Christianity. For those of you critical of this faulty concept, you're in the company of Rob Bell and numerous atheists he seems to agree with on this point. In the promo for his new book, Bell implies that if God is loving, he wouldn’t send people to hell (click here for his two-minute video speech).

As it turns out, this is an objection we usually get from atheists. In December 2009 I was in a panel debate on the topic, “Does the God of the Bible Exist?” where the atheists brought up this very objection. (click here for a five-minute video clip from the debate) For their objection to work, it must be based on: 1) an accurate representation of classical Christianity’s teachings on hell, and 2) a logical flow of thought. I will show it meets neither.

Featured Apologist: Clay Jones

Dr. Clay Jones is Assistant Professor of Christian Apologetics at Biola University. He teaches classes both on campus and in the modular program which include Why God Allows Evil, In Defense of the Resurrection, and Apologetics Research and Writing. He received his Doctor of Ministry from Trinity Evangelical Divinity School.

Learn More about Clay Here.

Dr. Jones recently started a blog which I was excited to hear as I consider him to be someone with tremendous knowledge and insight in many areas. The blog is off to a great start! Check out his blog here and be sure to add it to your blogroll. Posts include the following:

Humble Apologist?

Don't Be a Stupid Weakling: Listen to Advice

The Faulty Dilemma: Gays Are Either Born Gay or They Choose It

If you haven' t done so already, make sure you listen to Clay's interview with Brian Auten of Apologetics 315. Dr. Jones addresses the Problem of Evil, the destruction of the Canaanites, and more. A jam packed interview full of great information!

Also, keep a look out for Clay's forthcoming book Why God Allows Evil. In the meantime, be sure and read his article in Philosophia Christi, Vol. 11, No. 1, 2009, entitled "We Don't Hate Sin So We Don't Understand What Happened To The Canaanites." Look for another upcoming article in Philosophia Christi by Dr. Jones addressing the topic of Theodicy and Anthropodicy.

If you are looking for computer software dealing with Christian Apologetics, Prepared Defense is a must have. Clay is currently in the process of completing revising this software so keep an eye out for an updated edition!

The Debate Audio is Finally Here!

On December 9, 2009, Freethought Alliance hosted a debate at the Costa Mesa Civic Center titled "Does the God of the Bible Exist?" It was a 3-on-3 panel discussion between Christians and atheists.

The Christian side included Dr. Clay Jones from Biola University, Dr. Hugh Ross of Reasons to Believe, and our own Dan Grossenbach from Apologetic Junkie. The atheist panel included Dr. Bruce Flamm from the Inland Empire Atheists and Agnostics group, Mark Smith, and Alex Uzdavines.

Let me warn you in advance about this debate. The debate was quite lively and unconventional, which is why some would prefer to label it a panel discussion (or even a street fight!). The structure of this "debate" made a real debate nearly impossible. Unfortunately rhetoric often prevailed over reason and prevented genuine dialogue from taking place.

Full MP3 Debate Audio here.

In addition, due to the nature of the debate we thought it would be helpful to sit down with Dr. Clay Jones and Dan Grossenbach for a post-debate interview. Be sure to listen to their thoughts and reflections regarding the debate. It takes a lot more time to answer the difficult questions than it does to ask them. Hopefully this interview will answer the questions that time, format, and interruptions did not allow.

Full MP3 Post-Debate Audio Interview here.

We appreciate comments and feedback. Enjoy!

Debate Feedback

On Wednesday, Dr. Hugh Ross (Reasons to Believe), Dr. Clay Jones (Biola), and I debated three atheists at the Costa Mesa Community Center in a packed room of about 300. The crowd appeared evenly split between skeptics and Christians based on a hand tally requested by two of the debaters in an early exchange.

It was one of the most unique experiences I've ever had in my apologetics ministry. In general, I've received positive feedback from Christians, but I'm curious to hear honest feedback from others who were there that night. Soon, I plan to write a summary of the arguments and give my perspective, but for now, I'm asking for input on the event. Perhaps we can start another discussion here on the Junkie. I know my perspective from on stage, but what's yours?

My First Debate

I've recently been challenged by an atheist to defend Christianity. While this is nothing new, this time, it's going to be recorded before a live audience of 500. It's a 3-on-3 panel debate on the topic "Does the God of the Bible Exist?" at the Costa Mesa civic center on the evening of December 9th.

As some of you know, I'm coordinating a debate between Sean McDowell and Dr. Jim Corbett for February 26th, 2010. It wasn't my intention to get involved in another one, let alone as a debater, but I'm excited about putting my training to the test. I am blessed to report that Christian brothers Clay Jones and Hugh Ross will be seated on the panel with me.

CLAY JONES, M.Div - Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, is a professor of Christian Apologetics at Biola University. Prior to teaching at Biola, Dr. Jones was host of a weekly, call-in nationally syndicated talk radio program. Dr. Jones was the executive director of Simon Greenleaf University (now Trinity Law School), which offered degrees in law, Christian apologetics, and international human rights. Dr. Jones authored Prepared Defense, an interactive apologetics software program, encyclopedia articles on theodicy, evil, and suffering; journal articles on why God ordered the destruction of the Canaanites, and has a forthcoming book, Why God Allows Evil. Dr. Jones has been on the pastoral staff of two large churches and speaks widely on why God allows evil; Crusades, Inquisitions, Witch-hunts, etc.; the glory that awaits the Christian in heaven; and related topics. Here are a few examples of groups Clay has debated:

• a Buddhism professor
• the head of the Islamic Information Institute
• a Muslim cleric
• a Church of Scientology minister
• Mormon leaders
• Jehovah’s Witness leaders
• representatives of the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice
• the Council for democratic and Secular Humanism
• KFI’s Bill Handle
• a UCI professor on evil
• Gay rights activists
• a pastor who helps people form their own religions

HUGH ROSS, founder and president of Reasons to Believe, completed his undergraduate degree in physics (University of British Columbia) and graduate degrees in astronomy (University of Toronto). At Caltech he researched quasi-stellar objects, or "quasars," some of the most distant and ancient objects in the universe. He and his colleagues at Reasons To Believe keep tabs on the frontiers of research and how it connects with biblical theology. In this realm, he has written many books, including: The Fingerprint of God, The Creator and the Cosmos, Beyond the Cosmos, The Genesis Question, A Matter of Days, Creation As Science, and Why the Universe Is the Way It Is. Between writing books and articles and hosting Creation Update, a weekly live webcast, Hugh travels the world challenging students and faculty, churches and professional groups to consider what they believe and why. He presents a persuasive case for Christianity without applying pressure. Because he treats people's questions and comments with respect, he is in great demand as a speaker and as a talk-radio and television guest. Hugh has debated some of the sharpest atheist minds including a recent debate on the existence of God with Dr. Victor Stenger.

And then there's me, M.A. Christian Apologetics - Biola University. I'm the amateur apologist of the group and a federal criminal investigator by profession. I also teach apologetics at Mount of Olives Church in Mission Viejo and blog on this site. My area of specific interest is with epistemology and the argument for God based on the reality of objective moral values.

The atheists on the other side of the panel include Mark Smith, Alex Uzdavines, and Bruce Goings. Mark Smith runs the anti-Christian website http://www.jcnot4me.com/. Alex Uzdavines is a leader of the atheist club at UCI. Bruce Goings from the Inland Empire Atheist & Agnostics group and has over 1,200 blog posts on the IEAA message board.

This event is hosted by Freethought Alliance which is a network of local atheist groups from the greater LA metro area so we certainly won't be on our home turf. The debate will be moderated by Brian Dunning, a skeptic blogger who runs the site http://www.skeptoid.com/. Opening and closing statements will be much shorter than usual to allow more time for a lively conversation. Five questions will be submitted in advance by each panel to the other side. At the debate, each side will alternate asking the questions of the opposing panel who will give their prepared response followed by closely moderated discussion. The remaining time will be spent addressing questions submitted online. Being an atheist site, most questions are likely to be slanted against us. Email debate@freethoughtalliance.org to submit your question today!

We hope you can join us for an exciting night. If you have any skeptical friends, this would be a tremendous opportunity to bring your conversation to a much deeper level. Let us do the dirty work in bringing up the uncomfortable questions and then you can follow-up over coffee the next day with a simple, "So, what did you think?" Unfortunately, the event isn't free, but costs just $10 if you buy through Paypal in advance (otherwise it's $20 at the door). DVDs will be available for purchase too. At the risk of sounding like a salesman, there really is limited space in the auditorium (500) so if you're interested, you might want to reserve your seat soon. Visit the Freethought Alliance website for more info.

Clay, Hugh, and I are asking for your prayers during our preparation and that ears are opened for those who need to hear the truth.